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 Post subject: RP and Pkilling
PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2005 1:05:27am 
Joined: Sat Jul 17, 2004 12:52:53am
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We all know what the rules are concerning roleplaying and pkilling, so im going to give my opinion on the subject. It WEAK roleplaying to level a character to 100 mil or whatever and make some grand statement about your pkilling policy, which includes killing the peeps who got you there. 'Im good and your evil' just dont wash as roleplaying to me when you had no problem running with those same evil characters when you needed or wanted their help. You want to pkill, just do it, and do it from birth, and roleplay it like you mean it, and then you wont have to make amends for it when you come out looking like a knob in the end.


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 Post subject: I agree
PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2005 1:24:57am 
Joined: Mon Jul 18, 2005 1:25:05pm
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I agree with first part of this statement. I considered since last age kinda dumb people got to level 60 (max at that time) then make a rolepay to go kill and impose your way of playing.I saw many do this and still think its cheesy to get big enough to finally do stuff you wouldnt dare for a second as level 20. I used Thorak since level 40 killin evils and kept that rp till the day the age ended. I got hunt down and stuff but i didnt group with evils to help me level. Neither had evils in my stronghold. I made Leviatan too a gnome mage in a week and didnt fight noone on the way up cause none was around. But didnt group with trolls and other stuff that broke his beliefs.

It stikes me that people who wanna pk wait a lot to say what they really wanna do. Of course it could be called strategy but since the are no hard written rules about this ,like the ones we had in guilds, then everybody does as they please. This aint good cause you could have people thinking you rp certain way and in reality you are just ready to backstab em and jump their corpse. Which to me isnt honorable if you got helped by those. Not thinking of the help of the char but of the person itself.

Anyway i dont mind pk as you know. Im one of the few who keeps enjoying it thru the ages i just think since we all different we should respect each other way of playing and try not to do covert/not consistant roleplays as we see fit once we are strong enough to take on half the mud.
Otherwise bring it on, theres enough variety in races, align to make a roleplay to stick too since the day a char is created and it doesnt include pkillin. You can either be a pacifist, a blacksmith, an magic salesman, a transporter, an eq getter, some assassin, thief, hero, dragonslayer, killer of the light, killer of evils or just plain jackass. hehe Take yer pick


Last edited by Torak on Mon Oct 17, 2005 7:00:47pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2005 10:14:26am 
Joined: Sun Apr 16, 2006 9:12:10pm
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Too bad the person being referred too (I think) rarely reads this forum.

My take is that current management loves pkill (and always did) so whoever wants to do whatever 'hate hald the mud'/late developed "RP" they desire, as long as they pkill, can do so.

All in all, I couldn't agree with ya more Annahita.




edit: removed cheesy as an adjective as it was poor choice of word


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 Post subject: my worthless 2 cents
PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2005 1:28:01pm 
Joined: Wed Sep 14, 2005 10:19:43pm
Posts: 103
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This mud cracks me up quite often. It is no surprise to me that nobody every attempts to role play after observing the criticism somebody recieves when they do make an attempt. Sure, i exp'ed from 20 mil to mebbe 45 or 50 mil with others help, but i didn't know what i wanted from the character at the time. Call it bad role play, call it what you want but hell, I am trying to stick to a rp now.
I am just as guilty with my alts as many others on this mud when it comes to really really crappy role play...but I certainly wasn't when i came here. The thought of an elf grouping with a troll horrified me and boggled my mind. Here it is common place...as is trolls helping kill the SG guards and goodlies killing elves for tomes/equip etc etc. I mean, honestly, can you immagine a fantasy world where those events would take place? It would have to be one twisted story. As I was saying...I am just as guilty as anybody else when it comes to this. I have used Rrok to kill the big 3 many times. I have become numb to the bad role play and eventually became a part of it.
Ok, so I got tired of my crappy play and try to tighten up a little. It took me a while to decide that I needed to do this and what I would even do...but I eventually decided. I have doubled my exp since the time i announced my rp and enjoy often beatings from armand and torak as I attemp to exp. Hell, that's the way it should be! But i log onto the forums and people just complain?.....why?...because they don't want to be killed?...so they can try to insult somebody actually taking a stab at role play? Sure, i am not perfect but i am trying at least..which is more than I can say for most of you. This is not a "barney mud", pkill is part of the game and i believe solid role play should be as well.
If you think my role play is just hack and slash, then you have apparently not had any contact with me on your goodly characters. Oh well....I do not mind critique from others on role play, but it is pretty hard to swallow critique from people that don't even make an effort (although a very select few do)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2005 6:26:31pm 
Joined: Mon Jul 18, 2005 1:25:05pm
Posts: 101
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Quote:
Too bad the person being referred too (I think) rarely reads this forum.

My take is that current management loves pkill (and always did) so whoever wants to do whatever 'hate hald the mud'/late developed "RP" they desire, as long as they pkill, can do so.

All in all, I couldn't agree with ya more Annahita.




edit: removed cheesy as an adjective as it was poor choice of word
Actually i was speaking more in general and if i wanna put examples i would say Umro mostly and some of his allies. They came took experience and knowledge of us then started the killin. Not everybody is the same. I aint critizicing the guy, he sure knew how to pk and later knowing him better wasnt so bad.I just responded to the main topic. Which are roleplays and rules the stuff i wrote is directed to all news and olds.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2005 10:31:30pm 
Joined: Sat Jul 17, 2004 12:52:53am
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The point I'm trying to make is that there is more to roleplaying than fabricating a reason to pkill. They are not even the same thing. The rule is, if you want to pkill, you have to roleplay it. "Ok, so I got tired of my crappy play and try to tighten up a little. It took me a while to decide that I needed to do this and what I would even do...but I eventually decided." What you decided was that you wanted to start pkilling, not that you wanted to start roleplaying. They are not mutually inclusive.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2005 11:08:34pm 
Joined: Wed Sep 14, 2005 10:19:43pm
Posts: 103
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Quote:
The point I'm trying to make is that there is more to roleplaying than fabricating a reason to pkill. ...... What you decided was that you wanted to start pkilling, not that you wanted to start roleplaying.
My role play involves attempting to rise up the holy in the land in an attempt to irradicate evil. Perhaps this sometimes means hunting evils, but more generally it means that I am actually trying to role play a goodly in the fight of good vs evil. Most of the mythical storied we read are about this epic struggle, and my character is merely attempting to begin that struggle again.
People choose align just b/c of equip that best suits them, and it doesn't have a damn thing to do with their role play. Yes, pkill is a part of that role play, but it is a general theme of actually playing a goodly like a goodly is supposed to be played.....or at least my interpretation of how it is to be played in this context.


Last edited by Luz on Tue Oct 18, 2005 1:00:22am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Roleplay
PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2005 12:04:51am 
Joined: Mon Jul 18, 2005 1:25:05pm
Posts: 101
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Roleplay as i see it is how you develop your mud self thru the times. It involves how you group, how you play, what your align choice is, your knowledge and how you apply it. It involves also pk but it aint all to it. Saying all evil must die makes you just a mass murdrer and killin all evils you see in your path would involve killin also all mobs you see in your travels which is kindda nuts cause you wouldnt finish. Good as opposed as you think isnt always offensive. In those stories you mention goodly people even when fighting evil showed mercy and to keep balance left the natural order of things do their thing. Good folks protect, defend, do honorable things, make good deeds, try to change the way of people. Not with the sword all the times but also with the mind. Trying to get em too change their evil ways and be saved. If not vanquish em. Cause ultimately the path of good is the hard one. atm you have it easy vs evils, you just go and kill whoever is around. I also have seen you kill goodly mobs , perhaps a mistake but you done it. That would corrupt your rp.

I dont see good folks in tales killin every mercenary, bartender, beggar, soldier, traveller just because they assume since they do wicked things their souls are gone and must die at all costs. In wars i accept they do but in a regular tale of a world in "peace" i just dont see it. I would prefer you called yourself Luz the vanquisher or Luz Wrath of the holy light but not just saying im goodly i take my father sword to kill any evil even if they never did anything to you and dont know if they can be saved.

The path of the holy gets twisted like the desc of the paladin tells. I saw you kill my neutral char Macho when i was fighting the Baker. You never seen him as Luz and yet you hunted him down even before making sure he was evil. Then when you found him you attacked while he was attacking the baker (neutral mob) , didnt even bother to check his align cause all you wanted to do was get a pkill and you got it in an unhonorable and disgraceful way for a goodly. That personally I think it stinks, to attack players while they are killin some mob. Thats the way of the evils and murdrers. And for that I consider your role weak and flawed.

You are learning as your char is but if u wanna bring the holy light make sure you do it in the right way or change that rp and align.


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 Post subject: Re: Roleplay
PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2005 12:57:04am 
Joined: Wed Sep 14, 2005 10:19:43pm
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Luz looks to a world overridden with evils, and attempts to create a balance in that world. In his eyes, this is not a time of "peace" as you put it, but rather a time of war. You attempt to dishonor his role play by saying he does not attack every evil mob, or that he has killed a goodly mob on the way....but first of all there is a game factor to this and nobody could ever completely immerse themselves in their character (unless perhaps they needed some form of psychiatric help :wink: ) As a player I am at least making at attempt to role play....like it or not I could care less....i am making an attempt which is more than I can say for most on this mud. Sure, you may have a view of how a goodly should be role played as some peaceful guy that goes around blessing people and telling them to turn to the light etc etc etc...but in Luz's eyes the battle has been won by the darkness and has long since been forgotten. He feels that he must take up the sword to begin that battle anew. Once again...it is NOT a time of peace as he sees it.

So you bring up again the killing of Macho in a feeble attempt to justify your argument....luz did not travel to cimmura that day to find and or kill Macho. He was there to kill various shopkeepers in an attempt to grow stronger to fight for his cause. He ran across macho on his way to kill the baker himself, and in error believed Macho was evil. A red vortex around you was mistaken for a red aura....I appologized for the error and returned the money looted from your corpse. You then go on to say that it is awful to attack somebody while they are fighting a mob...yet your characters have repeatedly attacked luz while he fights mobs. That being said...I think it is fine to attack somebody in such a situation....and i welcome the offensife.


Well, as I said once again...its no damn wonder why nobody tries to develop a role play on this mud seeing the backlash when they do. Oh well, I guess you have to not give a sh*t what people think and do your rp to the best of your ability.


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 Post subject: Re: Roleplay
PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2005 1:40:43am 
Joined: Mon Jul 18, 2005 1:25:05pm
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Quote:
Luz looks to a world overridden with evils, and attempts to create a balance in that world. In his eyes, this is not a time of "peace" as you put it, but rather a time of war. You attempt to dishonor his role play by saying he does not attack every evil mob, or that he has killed a goodly mob on the way....but first of all there is a game factor to this and nobody could ever completely immerse themselves in their character (unless perhaps they needed some form of psychiatric help :wink: ) As a player I am at least making at attempt to role play....like it or not I could care less....i am making an attempt which is more than I can say for most on this mud. Sure, you may have a view of how a goodly should be role played as some peaceful guy that goes around blessing people and telling them to turn to the light etc etc etc...but in Luz's eyes the battle has been won by the darkness and has long since been forgotten. He feels that he must take up the sword to begin that battle anew. Once again...it is NOT a time of peace as he sees it.

So you bring up again the killing of Macho in a feeble attempt to justify your argument....luz did not travel to cimmura that day to find and or kill Macho. He was there to kill various shopkeepers in an attempt to grow stronger to fight for his cause. He ran across macho on his way to kill the baker himself, and in error believed Macho was evil. A red vortex around you was mistaken for a red aura....I appologized for the error and returned the money looted from your corpse. You then go on to say that it is awful to attack somebody while they are fighting a mob...yet your characters have repeatedly attacked luz while he fights mobs. That being said...I think it is fine to attack somebody in such a situation....and i welcome the offensife.


Well, as I said once again...its no damn wonder why nobody tries to develop a role play on this mud seeing the backlash when they do. Oh well, I guess you have to not give a sh*t what people think and do your rp to the best of your ability.
Of course my chars have attacked people that way after all they are evil and if like you say we wanna role play that would be the logical choice since you consider em wicked and evil. :wink: And to Macho you apologized for the mistake till i yelled about it and asked for retribution. You didnt offer it first hand so it felt forced since you knew you made a huge mistake. Again thats just not cool. He lost 300k and 1 life because you saw a red vortex. I get it, it was a mistake , its cool, but try to be more careful.

You love to pk in all the muds you play and you wanna be the best killer ,then you invent a roleplay you want but ultimately is for the same purpose pvp. It gives you a rush, its more challenging, etc whatever reason you got its your own. Which is fine by me im one of the few that do not fear you and even hunt you down. You enjoy pk more than I do thats your problem but dont sound so hurt if you get critized since you love what you do and will continue to do so no matter what anyone says.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2005 2:16:30am 
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Website: http://www.wocmud.org
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Phew, that's a lot to read :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: my worthless 2 cents
PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2005 7:27:27am 
Joined: Sun Apr 16, 2006 9:12:10pm
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Sure, i exp'ed from 20 mil to mebbe 45 or 50 mil with others help, but i didn't know what i wanted from the character at the time.
You really think you can pull the wool over everyones eyes?

1) This is so funny I almost pee'd myself, Luz. The person you killed most recently, one who is evil, one with whom you got to lvl 60 and beyond knows you talked endlessly about your pkill plans for the Luz char.

2) You are a pkiller personality as Torak suggests. You love the stuff. You live for the stuff. You did on Cythera, you did on old WoC, you did on Insymnia, and you do now. I'm not judging, but it's absolutely obvious you love it. That being said, if you expect anyone to believe you ever make chars w/o thinking about how to optimize your pkill addiction, you're way off base and don't have any semblance of an idea of the general understanding of others on how you, specifically, love to mud. (note: i'm not condemning the pkill bloodlust you've displayed for years, simply noting that it's been out there, you wearing it on your sleeve and most everyone knows it. To claim you don't build thinking about it is absolutely hillarious.).

3) You built a mage/shaman. C'mon. That's a pkill build if I ever saw one. Remarkably similar to Torak who was rumoured to have a good pkill char prior to your return to WoC. You leveraged the gnome, the mage, and added some cool pkill spells from the piety side. The second I knew what you were making, well prior to 20 mil let alone 45 or 50 mil, I told Plinia to watch how much she helped you as the pkill char was coming and she'd die by your hand too. And, she did. Surprise, surprise.

You might have convinced yourself about this crap about not knowing through a long arduous self brain-washing, but since at least one person was told, ad nauseum, about your plans, and the other points I raise - at least show a tiny bit of respect that people have the intelligence and don't/won't believe you when you say you had no idea what your plans were.

Oh, and nice attempt at reversing things towards your accusers and their own insufficient role play. However, the fact remains the same, you can claim what you want about knowing or not knowing, you can pick yer "role play" when you're well powerful enough, you can try to reverse the topic - but our eyes are wide open.


Last edited by Grael on Tue Oct 18, 2005 12:51:13pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2005 8:28:33am 
Joined: Sat Jul 17, 2004 12:52:53am
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It's not a question of ability, Luz. You are clearly a superior mudder, with an enviable pool of knowledge, experience and ability. I guess that's why I was prompted to make my post, because I know you can do better than that. For all your reasoning, your RP was chosen to allow you maximum player targets. Its also one you have explored before (we all remember Solaris). To be truthful, the best example of RP I've seen you perform was when Dantor killed Janx for ignoring him. Now THATS roleplaying!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2005 11:18:11am 
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Grael said: The second I knew what you were making, well prior to 20 mil let alone 45 or 50 mil, I told Plinia to watch how much she helped you as the pkill char was coming and she'd die by your hand too. And, she did. Surprise, surprise.

O.k. guys, this is gonna be one of my stupid posts as usual =) What grael says is true. I did know what was coming and I knew that there was a good chance I would get stabbed in the back by Luz so I'm not surprised that I did (o.k. maybe a little, but thats a different story :wink: )

I dont agree with the way he went about enforcing his RP, but he is and there is really nothing we can do about it. You all know he is a great mudder, I know hes a great mudder and that he likes t o pkill. We all knew it was gonna happen someday, that someone would start actively pkilling, it was just a matter of time.

O.k. so as usual you should ignore everything I have said since it make no sense whatsoever, much like my other posts 8)

cheers


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 Post subject: Roleplaying
PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2005 11:55:31am 
Joined: Mon Jul 18, 2005 1:25:05pm
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Saddly our player base is not big enough in my opinion to enforce some roleplays unless you wanna end up been a loner. Some races and aligns have very few representatives and therefore see the need to group with races and aligns that in other case they wouldnt. People and classes need people because besides mages no other class is self sufficient to get best equipment for their class alone. Or not entirely at least so therefore needs other people and other big people around are just us. And we as players do want to have best stuff, claiming otherwise is a lie.

Now as evil let me explain my roleplay on Armand. As his character desc here on forum says, he dont like orcs and goblins nor vampires. But since there are almost none of those around when he plays he hasnt killed much out there. Armand is a dwarf who enjoys caves and gettin shinies, he has done so and helps groups all the time. As he is evil he can group with whoever he likes. That includes goodlies. Why? Well because he uses em for his own benefit, therefore tolerate em. He is evil but he usually is expin alone cause he was used to loneliness on his dark caves. He is not on a quest to kill good and balance the world so he gets more experienced. You claim that he dont roleplay simply for the fact that hes not out there killin people? well as his rp states he will probably kill those races when he seems em, but until then he just will hunt Luz since he openly made war on evils. In other case he probably wouldnt hunt Luz down. So to my rp i think i do pretty ok since i made it to fit armand and i dont see myself breakin that.


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